Biodegradeable ATF!??!

[Canadianbombar]

Our Mountain assistant manager approached me with an idea regrading ATF the other day. Apparently there are now "environmentally friendly" degradeable varieties available and being in a provincial park we get crapped on for losing ATF on the mountain. I told her it was a good idea...but if I was to take a guess it would be along the lines of bio-diesel...not have the same properties as regualr ATF and would eventually ruin the pumps etc like bio-diesel ruins engines. Therefore it's a good idea that's a no-go until I hear good things about it. Anyone been using this stuff for any amount of time??

[admin]

All I've heard is that you still have to follow the same spill/cleanup procedures as you do for regular ATF, because while it may be considered biodegradeable, it still has hazardous properties.

[Tom400CFI]

I think Solitude and Brighton have been using "biodegradable" hydro (not "ATF") for a long time. The question is; is it "readily biodegradeable". Because ALL oil is "biodegradeable"...eventually. Many so called "bio oils" really aren't. Be careful w/the marketing lingo and facts.

it would be along the lines of bio-diesel...not have the same properties as regualr ATF and would eventually ruin the pumps etc like bio-diesel ruins engines.

Where did that come from? Bio-diesel is actually better for engines than regular diesel, as it provides better lubrication for the pumps and injectors, as well as a natural detergent that cleanses better than the detergent added to regular diesel.

We have been running B20 in the winter and B50 in the summer for 5 years now. Zero ill effects.

[Canadianbombar]

Tom,

I was more refering to the french fry cats from several years back. Sugarloaf sticks in my mind...they ran some cats and some buses on diesel they made themselves and everything they ran the stuff thru needed new motors by the end of the season. As to Bio-hydro...I'm highly suspicious...Any of the sites I've seen for it state stuff like "similar properties to regular hydro" etc etc. SIMILAR being the key word there..I don't see an SAE stamp on any of it.

[Tom400CFI]

Sugarloaf sticks in my mind...they ran some cats and some buses on diesel they made themselves and everything they ran the stuff thru needed new motors by the end of the season.

Really? That happened? I can't imagine why the fuel would ruin the motor. We have run "home brew", B100 "French fry oil" in some of our diesel engines here (not in the cats), and had great success/no issues. From a technical stand point, I can't understand what happened at the loaf. Doesn't make sense to me.

As to Bio-hydro...I'm highly suspicious...Any of the sites I've seen for it state stuff like "similar properties to regular hydro" etc etc. SIMILAR being the key word there..I don't see an SAE stamp on any of it.

I think that you should be suspicious. It's a fledgling product, and somewhat untested and unregulated, as I see it. It's hard to get clear answers about those products...both from the people who sell them and their competition. I would probably only switch if it was "readily biodegradable" (otherwise, what's the point?), and they were willing to FULLY warrantee our drive system components, hands down, for the "normal life" of the cat. To me that's 6-7000 hours.

I'd also probably try to have a good conversation w/Solitude, and Brighton, since they're in watershed and have to use readily biodegradable fluids.

[Canadianbombar]

I haven't heard anything good about the home brew diesel...only problems and blown this and that. You're pretty much the first person I've heard say they haven't had problems with it. I was with Patrick on this one...since you have to do the same clean up...there's no point. I'm pretty sure the bio stuff would also be more expensive and not have the same properties and thus cause problems. We were looking for a way to not have to do clean up to get away from having bags of dirty snow. I told her we best come up with a device for melting the snow and seperating the hydro rather than changing oils. Gonna melt the snow in an old deep freeze and bleed the water off the bottom I think.